Close To The Edge – A Prog-Rock Roundtable

With their bands Dream Theater, Queensrÿche, and Fates Warning, guitarists John Petrucci, Michael Wilton, and Jim Matheos sit atop today’s prog-rock mountain, an edifice originally erected by forebears like Genesis, Mahavishnu Orchestra, Yes, and Rush. Together in an exclusive roundtable, these three genius technicians discuss the past, the present, and the future of this explosive genre.

By Michael Mueller

In 1988, a relatively little-known band from Seattle called Queensryche released their third album, Operation: Mindcrime, a groundbreaking concept album that chronicled the lives of Nikki, Mary, Dr. X, and a priest in a dark underworld of drug addiction. prostitution, mind control, and abuse of religious power. The record’s first single, ‘Eyes of a Stranger,’ caught on at rock radio, and like a lion stalking prey in the veldt, Queensryche trampled the moussed coifs of hair metal, establishing the band as the genre’s alpha men, dominant in every musical sense. But record sales did not reflect this. Though the record sold over a million units, the band did not achieve the popular mega-success of musically inferior contemporaries Like Poison and Warrant.

Soon after, in 1989, prog-rockers Fates Warning released Perfect Symmetry. Though it was their fifth album, it was the first to break through to a larger audience, largely as a result of Mindcrime’s success the year prior. Metalheads appreciated the new outlet of highly technical music; the instrumental proficiency and superior composition of prog-rock combined with the aggressive, chunkier sound of metal.

At about the same time, a young group of Berklee-trained musicians calling themselves Dream Theater released their debut, When Dream and Day Unite. On the strength of a name that just screams “Prog!” a few adventurous fans of the genre discovered the virtuoso-driven record in the heavy-metal bins at their local record stores. It was enough to start a grassroots groundswell. Still, Dream Theater was a mere rest stop on the prog map.

In 1990, Queensrÿche released Empire, their most successful album to date. Neither as dark nor as heavy as the material on Mindcrime, singles like ‘Jet City Woman’ and ‘Silent Lucidity’ appealed to a wide fan base, even finding success at MTV. It was on this tour, too, that Queensrÿche would first perform Mindcrime live from beginning to end (later recorded and released as Operation: Livecrime). This not only appeased their longtime fans but introduced new fans to the band’s grittier roots.

Then, in 1992, at the height of grunge. Dream Theater slammed the prog-metal gavel down with Images and Words, a tight, slickly produced collection of epic compositions featuring virtuoso performances from all four instrumentalists as well as the vocal acrobatics of new singer James LaBrie. The band’s first single, ‘Pull Me Under,’ caught the attention of metal fans hungry for a respite from the out-of-tune, stripped-down sounds of grunge, and positioned guitarist John Petrucci & Co. as the new prog-metal poster boys.

Now, 11 years later. relying on a fiercely loyal mutual fan base, Dream Theater, Queensrÿche and Fates Warning are still the preeminent practitioners of prog-metal. And tonight, all three are at the PNC Bank Arts Center in Holmdel, New Jersey, only one stop on what is for many a prog fan a dream tour come true.

On arrival. Dream Theater and Queensrÿche are onstage rehearsing Pink Floyd’s ‘Comfortably Numb’ for their end-of-show jam. While singers LaBrie and Geoff Tate discuss transitions between verses, Petrucci breaks into the outro section of Metallica’s ‘Fade to Black’ and chats with Queensrÿche touring guitarist Mike Stone. After a few minutes. Dream Theater drummer Mike Portnoy reins everybody in, and they pick up just before the solos. Michael Wilton faithfully reproduces David Gilmour’s soulful lines, adding his own searing touches here and there.

Meanwhile, backstage Fates Warning’s road manager bristles with a sense of urgency, as his band was supposed to be finished with soundcheck at 5:30; it’s now 5:45, and they haven’t even begun. By some miracle, the sound check takes only 15 minutes – it’s now 6:05. Temporarily relieved and hoping to begin our interview. I’m suddenly informed that Michael Wilton needs to be fitted for new ear molds for his in-ear monitors.

Waiting, I notice that many of the band members are now hanging out near the backstage entrance. Watching LaBrie and Tate laughing with friends and crew members, you get a sense of camaraderie as well as the mutual respect these bands have for one another, as Mike Stone tells the story of how he had only 45 minutes to learn Dream Theater’s ‘Peruvian Skies’ for the jam session one night, thus needing an impromptu guitar lesson from Petrucci.

Finally, Queensrÿche’s tour manager approaches. We’re set to go. Wilton, Jim Matheos and I adjourn to an adjacent tent containing a beat-up folding table, dirty lawn chairs and an old but functioning refrigerator. Petrucci jogs up the steps a few minutes later. skipping every other stair without spilling so much as a drop from his filled-to-the-brim cola.

This tour is a dream come true for prog fans. Has it been all that for you as well?

Jim Matheos: Absolutely. I love both bands; all the guys have been great. A lot of times as an opening band, you get stomped on, but we’ve been treated so great. It’s like hanging out with a bunch of friends. The only way this could be better would be to put Rush on the bill. [laughs]

John Petrucci: Yeah, it’s been really cool. We’re playing ‘Take Hold of the Flame’ together at the end of the show, which is a real treat.

Your bands essentially represent the cream of the prog-rock crop. As guitar players, what attracted you to this style?

JP: I was really into Yes and Rush, the early stuff. Those were the two main progressive bands. Then later, there was Iron Maiden and Metallica. And Queensrÿche was a big influence as well.

Michael Wilton: I don’t consider myself a really progressive guitar player. I do have certain influences that go back to John McLaughlin and Al Di Meola and guys like that, but my influences are more melodic as well, like the Beatles, Hendrix, Zeppelin.

JM: Same for me. I’ve got different influences – some from the rock side like UFO, Black Sabbath, Deep Purple, and some from the progressive side like ELP, Genesis, Rush. So I think that somehow, those blended together into what you hear now.

Michael, what brings you to a band like Queensrÿche then, rather than a straight-ahead rock ‘n’ roll band?

MW: It’s the chemistry of the band. Five guys constantly butting heads trying to put their influence into the band. I think that goes for just about every band that’s been around as long as we have. We always try to get the monster riff into it, but let’s make the drums interesting, cool fills, not just mono beats. And let’s make the vocal melodies interesting with harmonies and stuff. You blend that together and you get this cool music that you like, and you hope it truly translates to people. Then, all of a sudden, they’re like, “Wow, they’re progressive.” [laughs]

Speaking of which, how do you define prog-rock?

JM: Man, I get asked that question a lot. I don’t know.

JP: To me, if I had to think of one band to sum it up, I’d say it was Yes. To me, that’s prog. There are many others, and our bands have taken that kind of orchestration and style and melded it with metal. But, it’s instrumentally, um... what’s it called?

MW: Instrumentally challenged? [laughs]

JP: I just think there’s a big emphasis on the instrumental part of it.

What are other key elements of progressive rock?

JM: I think there needs to be a certain level of musicianship to it, obviously. Just to get down to the root of the word progressive, you need to do something different each time and not rehash the same old thing.

MW: Just not fitting the pop format, stepping outside the box, taking chances. Instead of doing something in 4/4, try 6/4 or 7/8, or something completely out there. Make it unique and more interesting. I think there will always be bands that fit that genre and will be marketed that way. I hope that it remains a specialty genre and never becomes popular, so it stays unique and special.

Which new bands do you think will carry on the progressive rock torch?

JM: There are several bands that I listen to, like Porcupine Tree, Opeth. King’s X, but I don’t think they’re classified as prog, really. They certainly have their prog roots. but I’m not very good at categorizing stuff. I either like it or I don’t.

JP: They’re all great – really good players in those bands.

I’m going to toss out some band names. Give me your first thought on each: Mahavishnu Orchestra.

MW: John McLaughlin – the master.

JM: Definitely. I was into them, too. I remember seeing them on ‘Don Kirshner’s Rock Concert.’

MW: It was always interesting to see the way he played; he played like a saxophone player – outside the envelope. To me, that was true progressive playing.

JP: Funny enough, it’s something I really hadn’t heard until fairly recently, I hate to admit.

MW: Really? I thought that was a big influence on you.

JP: Yeah, some people name bands – like early Kansas – that they think are influences and they may be to a couple of other members. It’s great music, but I never really listened to it until recently.

Yes.

JP: They were the biggest influence on me.

JM: Steve Howe was a big influence. I spent quite a few weeks trying to learn ‘Mood For a Day.’

MW: I remember learning that, too. Fragile was a cool album. Close to the Edge is still one of my favorite albums of all time: it’s just a masterpiece.

Rush.

[Wilton and Matheos respond in sync]: What can you say?

JM: They’re one of my top three favorite bands of all time.

JP: Yeah, I was a big, big Rush fan, particularly the early stuff.

MW: I’ve hung out with those guys many times; they’re great. They certainly have the chops.

They seem like a bridge between bands like Yes and modern-day prog groups like yourselves.

MW: Alex Lifeson, being in a one-guitar band, he took the guitar and made everything sound more open by adding open strings.

JM: Instead of just 5ths, he played full chords, lots of sus chords. That’s where I learned my sus chords.

MW: Exactly! They really filled the mix.

JM: And that’s what introduced me to odd time, before I got into prog-rock.

King Crimson.

MW: Fripp is just awesome. He’s really bizarre sometimes, atonal, very experimental. I just got their latest album.

JM: I heard it’s supposed to be great, but I haven’t heard it yet.

MW: It’s really cool.

JP: They’re another band that I didn’t really know early on. I was at Berklee when this guy came in with a Stick, and I was like, “What the hell?” And the guy’s like, “You know, Tony Levin?” But I didn’t. Obviously, I was in store for some great music.

Pink Floyd.

JM: They’re one of my favorite bands. Even to this day, I still listen to everything from Obscured by Clouds through The Final Cut through The Division Bell. David Gilmour is one of my top three favorite guitar players. His tone. his sense of melody. He says so much in two or three notes, much more than a lot of people say with 10 times that many.

MW: The Wall. When we recorded The Warning, we used James Guthrie only because he worked on The Wall. That album had a big impact on us.

Interesting that you mention that; it’s a concept record, and you’ve all done concept records. Is it tough to do from a musical standpoint?

JP: It’s a blast. The approach is completely different; you’re obviously not just writing a bunch of songs that have nothing to do with one another. And you have to think of the flow of the record. We didn’t necessarily write our pieces in order on Scenes From a Memory, but we knew what was the beginning, what was the end and pretty much knew where we wanted to go. So I think there was much more direction and planning involved to be one big picture rather than concentrating on the individual songs.

What comes first, the story or the music?

JP: We wrote the music first. We had the concept for the story, but we wrote the music before the lyrics.

MW: With Operation: Mindcrime, it was the opposite. Geoff [Tate] had the idea, and he gave us this rough outline. Chris [DeGarmo] and I had written a bunch of songs already, so it was a matter of connecting the dots, filling in the spaces, trying to understand what he was trying to say. As it became more clear, we were able to say we need something ferocious here, something cynical there.

JM: Fortunately, for me, I got to do both. I wrote the lyrics and the music at the same time, so they helped write each other.

Is it something you would do again?

MW: Yes. but not the same thing. A lot of people have wanted us to do Mindcrime II, but why do that?

JP: That’s one of my favorite albums.

MW: Yeah, it’s my favorite album that we’ve done.

JM: I loved Mindcrime, but for me, my favorites were Rage for Order and Promised Land. I think that was a beautiful record, and every time I tell people that it was my favorite Queensrÿche record, they’re like, “What?”

What’s your favorite song or album of each other’s bands?

JM: I’d say Images and Words and portions of Awake.

MW: Mine is [Dream Theater’s] ‘Peruvian Skies.’

JP: I don’t know if I can name one single Queensrÿche song; there are so many great ones. Mindcrime is one of my favorite albums ever. I also love the older Fates Warning stuff. I keep trying to get Jim to play something, but they’re not doing that on this tour.

Any reason you’re not doing it, Jim?

JM: You know, it’s really just a question of what we like to do and what we’re comfortable with. Some of it is so old, and I can appreciate it on a certain level, and I can appreciate that the fans like to hear that stuff. But for us, if it’s not really fun to play, we don’t want to just go through the motions.

What’s next for each band?

JP: We’re almost finished with a new album; it should be out in the fall. It’s a new direction for us; it’s very cool. It’s hip-hop. [laughs] Actually, I’m very happy with it so far. I think it’s going to be a good one.

MW: Tribe comes out soon, so after this tour, we’ll start back up and probably tour through December and try to write another record sometime soon.

JM: We had just started writing for a new record when this tour opportunity came up. We weren’t gonna tour, but this was too good to pass up. So, when I get back, I’ll start writing, and hopefully we’ll have a record out by early 2004.

John, what’s up with your solo record?

JP: I’m going to finish that up when we’re done with our album. I was slowed down after I hurt my arm in a skiing accident, so it got delayed.

MW: What’s it like?

JP: It’s all instrumental, a cross between Steve Morse and Joe Satriani types of instrumental guitar music.

MW: If you want a guest appearance, I’ll play on a song!

I find it interesting that guys in prog often jam in side projects with guys from other bands.

JP: I think what happens is that there are certain players who really shine, and you get to the point where you have an opportunity to work with them. When I did G3 with Steve Vai and Joe Satriani, it was amazing. I mean, you’ve got Steve, Billy Sheehan, Satch, Mike [Portnoy], Dave LaRue on bass, and all these great players in one big community jamming together.

JM: I think one of the reasons is that guys in this genre have a huge range of influences, which opens them up to doing different-sounding projects. There’s really no reason to do it if it’s going to sound like your main band or the other guys’ bands.

What are your goals on the guitar?

JM: Unfortunately, at this point, I’m kind of set in my ways. There are things that I wish that I’d have practiced more when I was younger, like improvisation. Right now, the way I work, everything is worked out note by note the way I want to play it. I’m not real comfortable going up and doing an impromptu jam.

MW: I’m trying to do more subconscious meanderings. I wake up in the morning, still half asleep with a guitar by the bed. I just play; I don’t care what I play. I end up with a backlog of this stuff on a DAT recorder, and I don’t listen to it for a couple of days. Some of it sucks, some of it’s cool, and I pick that stuff out. That’s how I wrote Tribe; I did it in a week.

JP: For the album we’re working on now, I specifically wanted to do something different on it, to try to get to the next level of technique. So I did a lot of practicing before and during the sessions, listened to a lot of different guys, studied new things so I wouldn’t do the same thing again.

I’m not sure I can imagine John Petrucci taking it to another level.

MW: That’s scary! [laughs all around]